Monday, June 1, 2009

RE: [TheOptionClub.com] Re: Stangle on Rimm



Thank you,
my English he's second languge so sometime I'm getting mix.
My only problem with useing current month is if Rimm not going to move... then I need to adjust .so will see

Nava   


From: "mcatolico" <mcatolico@mindspring.com>
Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 10:17 AM
To: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [TheOptionClub.com] Re: Stangle on Rimm

"Vega/theta" is not a ratio. Sorry for the confusion but I just lump the two together since to me they are the same thing , namely, extrinsic value. Theta is just a "special case" of vega  in that it behaves in a lognormal fashion as a function of time.  In reality, extrinsic premium is all over the place and thus, from a risk perspective, I treat vega (slash) theta as a single phenomenon.

 

As I suggested, if you are making an earnings play, you'll likely get the best reward for risk if you play the month that the earnings happen. I can understand that there may be reasons to not own short term premium – though that way of thinking is pretty alien to me. So if you want to play the big delta movement you expect to occur in rimm, there's not much more I could suggest; july is as good as sep is as good as dec…

 

From: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com [mailto:OptionClub@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nava Elgar
Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 12:37 PM
To: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com
Subject: re: [TheOptionClub.com] Re: Stangle on Rimm

 


I never as a rule not buying long options with less then 45-90 days.
I do need movement and to belive that the stock can gain intrinsic value as the debit that I am paying.
But regarding to Vega/theta what is this ratio tells me?

Nava   







From: "karensoich" <mcatolico@mindspring.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 5:31 AM
To: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [TheOptionClub.com] Re: Stangle on Rimm

if you are doing this as an earnings play i would suggest you trade the month the earnings come out. if you believe that whatever happens after earnings will start a trend that you want to be in, i would wait until earnings are announced and then pounce on the direction you want to lean the trade with a vertical or other directional strategy.

you ask about the greeks. well the obvious risk is vega/theta. whatever happens after earnings are released, rimm iv will likely fall - particularly in those july or sep options - and thus you have to get enough big directional movement to compensate for the debit on the strangle (especially if you decide to play june expiration, as i suggest, which would expire immediately after earnings). so you have to be prepared to either have your fortune telling skills perfect (i.e. you guess correctly on a big post earnings move) or you have to be an aggressive seller of premium on pre-earnings opportunities or directly into any post earnings move.

--- In OptionClub@yahoogroups.com, "nava_elgar" <nava@...> wrote:
>
> Hello all,
>
> I am considering a trade on RIMM b4 earning .
> Rimm has earning June 18.
>
> I thought about on 80/75 Sep cost 16.75$ debit or to go on July same strike cost 11.15$ .
>
> my question:
>
> I don't look at greek so all the greek export here what do you think?
> I want to learn.
>
>
> when I am placing this kind of trade .I am just checking if the stock can move that far to make me profit.
>
> Nava Elgar
>





 

__._,_.___
The goal of TheOptionClub is to provide a forum for members to work together for the purpose of furthering our individual understanding option trading.  All messages and postings, and any materials circulated are provided for discussion and educational purposes only.  No statement contained in any materials from TheOptionClub should be considered a recommendation to buy or sell a security or to provide investment, legal or tax advice.  All investors are encouraged to consult a qualified professional before trading in any security.  Stock and option trading involves risk and is not suitable for most people.  There is no guarantee that any information provided is accurate and, may in fact, be wrong.  It is understood that the participants in TheOptionClub have varying backgrounds and degrees of experience in option trading, and that regardless of experience each member is considered a student.  As such, any information distributed through TheOptionClub should be considered with a critical mind and not relied upon as an authoritative source.

To unsubscribe from TheOptionClub, send an email to:
OptionClub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Recent Activity
Visit Your Group
Yahoo! Finance

It's Now Personal

Guides, news,

advice & more.

Search Ads

Get new customers.

List your web site

in Yahoo! Search.

Yahoo! Groups

Stay healthy

and discover other

people who can help.

.

__,_._,___
Posted by at No comments:

Re: [ConservativeOptionStrategies] if I sell a put and a call at the money



If you sell both then you'll get to keep the PUT premium and this will be offset by the loss on the call side.  If you buy both and the price increases then you'll lose on the PUT side and profit on the call side.  Which is better?  Depends on what you think is going to happen and of course the pricing. There are plenty of books and I'd suggest you get one called "Options as a Strategic Investment and read it 3 or 4 times.


http://www.amazon.com/Options-Strategic-Investment-Lawrence-McMillan/dp/0735201978/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1243915044&sr=8-1

On Sun, May 17, 2009 at 7:53 AM, paul7313 <paul7313@yahoo.com> wrote:


and the market goes up. how do I profit?

or is it better to buy a call and a put ATM? How do I profit?


__._,_.___
Recent Activity
Visit Your Group
Yahoo! Finance

It's Now Personal

Guides, news,

advice & more.

Ads on Yahoo!

Learn more now.

Reach customers

searching for you.

Group Charity

Stop Cyberbullying

Keep your kids

safe from bullying

.

__,_._,___
Posted by at No comments:

Re: [TheOptionClub.com] Re: advance adjustments



Martin,

You nailed it! I was thinking the same that this is copied from somewhere.

Yes, watch the CBOE videos, use free software such as Optionsoracle (www.samosky.com) and play with the price and chart, or use TOS analysis, etc.

"At least, that's my $0.02 worth..."

Hey, it is more than that :)

-
--- In OptionClub@yahoogroups.com, "janzen257" <yahoo.to.mj257@...> wrote:
>
> > Does anybody know how to do these adjustments, if so please show
> simulations in TOS.
> >
> > 1. BUTTERFLY ROLL
> > 2. ASYMMETRICAL BUTTERFLY ROLL
> > 3. ASYMMETRICAL BUTTERFLY RATIO ROLL
> > [you get the idea]
>
> Isn't this exactly like one of those "Do my homework for me!" questions
> that you see on technical forums all the time? Right...
>
> In this context, though, I get the distinct sense that this list comes
> from the marketing material for some sort of seminar or course, and that
> the writer is curious but doesn't want to spend thousands to learn the
> magic.
>
> If so, he's probably on the right track. A mess of jargon like this
> sounds to me like someone's trying to dress up some standard options
> theory and charge a bundle for teaching you the exclusive, hidden
> secrets previously known only to insiders.
>
> Sure, people in this business love to give flashy names to their trades:
> straddles, strangles, butterflies, iron condors -- I've even heard of
> "centipedes" and "pterodactyls", for crying out loud. And a certain
> amount of terminology is useful: it's easier and clearer to say, "I sold
> an iron condor" than "I sold a call spread and a put spread with the
> same underlying and the same expiration". But someone's really getting
> carried away here. Who on earth would say, "Oh, the price of XYZ has
> moved up; now I need to do an asymmetrical butterfly ratio roll"?
>
> My suggestion: Save your money. Instead, spend it on some good books
> (eg. Natenberg), watch the free videos at the CBOE (especially Dan
> Sheridan's), check out the educational materials that your broker
> provides, read forums such as this one -- in short, learn the basics.
> If you understand vertical spreads, you won't need to memorize the
> details of how and when to do an "asymmetrical butterfly ratio roll"
> versus a "symmetrical iron condor non-ratio roll", or what have you.
> You'll just look at what you have now, decide whether you still want it,
> figure out what you'd rather have instead, and then make the appropriate
> changes. No fancy names required.
>
> At least, that's my $0.02 worth...
>
> Martin
>

 


____________________________________________________________
Click now to find great remedies for hangovers!

__._,_.___
The goal of TheOptionClub is to provide a forum for members to work together for the purpose of furthering our individual understanding option trading.  All messages and postings, and any materials circulated are provided for discussion and educational purposes only.  No statement contained in any materials from TheOptionClub should be considered a recommendation to buy or sell a security or to provide investment, legal or tax advice.  All investors are encouraged to consult a qualified professional before trading in any security.  Stock and option trading involves risk and is not suitable for most people.  There is no guarantee that any information provided is accurate and, may in fact, be wrong.  It is understood that the participants in TheOptionClub have varying backgrounds and degrees of experience in option trading, and that regardless of experience each member is considered a student.  As such, any information distributed through TheOptionClub should be considered with a critical mind and not relied upon as an authoritative source.

To unsubscribe from TheOptionClub, send an email to:
OptionClub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Recent Activity
Visit Your Group
Yahoo! Finance

It's Now Personal

Guides, news,

advice & more.

New web site?

Drive traffic now.

Get your business

on Yahoo! search.

Weight Loss Group

on Yahoo! Groups

Get support and

make friends online.

.

__,_._,___
Posted by at No comments:

RE: [TheOptionClub.com] Re: Stangle on Rimm



“Vega/theta” is not a ratio. Sorry for the confusion but I just lump the two together since to me they are the same thing , namely, extrinsic value. Theta is just a “special case” of vega  in that it behaves in a lognormal fashion as a function of time.  In reality, extrinsic premium is all over the place and thus, from a risk perspective, I treat vega (slash) theta as a single phenomenon.

 

As I suggested, if you are making an earnings play, you’ll likely get the best reward for risk if you play the month that the earnings happen. I can understand that there may be reasons to not own short term premium – though that way of thinking is pretty alien to me. So if you want to play the big delta movement you expect to occur in rimm, there’s not much more I could suggest; july is as good as sep is as good as dec…

 

From: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com [mailto:OptionClub@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nava Elgar
Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 12:37 PM
To: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com
Subject: re: [TheOptionClub.com] Re: Stangle on Rimm

 



I never as a rule not buying long options with less then 45-90 days.
I do need movement and to belive that the stock can gain intrinsic value as the debit that I am paying.
But regarding to Vega/theta what is this ratio tells me?

Nava   







From: "karensoich" <mcatolico@mindspring.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 5:31 AM
To: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [TheOptionClub.com] Re: Stangle on Rimm

if you are doing this as an earnings play i would suggest you trade the month the earnings come out. if you believe that whatever happens after earnings will start a trend that you want to be in, i would wait until earnings are announced and then pounce on the direction you want to lean the trade with a vertical or other directional strategy.

you ask about the greeks. well the obvious risk is vega/theta. whatever happens after earnings are released, rimm iv will likely fall - particularly in those july or sep options - and thus you have to get enough big directional movement to compensate for the debit on the strangle (especially if you decide to play june expiration, as i suggest, which would expire immediately after earnings). so you have to be prepared to either have your fortune telling skills perfect (i.e. you guess correctly on a big post earnings move) or you have to be an aggressive seller of premium on pre-earnings opportunities or directly into any post earnings move.

--- In OptionClub@yahoogroups.com, "nava_elgar" <nava@...> wrote:
>
> Hello all,
>
> I am considering a trade on RIMM b4 earning .
> Rimm has earning June 18.
>
> I thought about on 80/75 Sep cost 16.75$ debit or to go on July same strike cost 11.15$ .
>
> my question:
>
> I don't look at greek so all the greek export here what do you think?
> I want to learn.
>
>
> when I am placing this kind of trade .I am just checking if the stock can move that far to make me profit.
>
> Nava Elgar
>





__._,_.___
The goal of TheOptionClub is to provide a forum for members to work together for the purpose of furthering our individual understanding option trading.  All messages and postings, and any materials circulated are provided for discussion and educational purposes only.  No statement contained in any materials from TheOptionClub should be considered a recommendation to buy or sell a security or to provide investment, legal or tax advice.  All investors are encouraged to consult a qualified professional before trading in any security.  Stock and option trading involves risk and is not suitable for most people.  There is no guarantee that any information provided is accurate and, may in fact, be wrong.  It is understood that the participants in TheOptionClub have varying backgrounds and degrees of experience in option trading, and that regardless of experience each member is considered a student.  As such, any information distributed through TheOptionClub should be considered with a critical mind and not relied upon as an authoritative source.

To unsubscribe from TheOptionClub, send an email to:
OptionClub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Recent Activity
Visit Your Group
Give Back

Yahoo! for Good

Get inspired

by a good cause.

Y! Toolbar

Get it Free!

easy 1-click access

to your groups.

Yahoo! Groups

Start a group

in 3 easy steps.

Connect with others.

.

__,_._,___
Posted by at No comments:

[TheOptionClub.com] Re: advance adjustments



Martin,

You nailed it! I was thinking the same that this is copied from somewhere.

Yes, watch the CBOE videos, use free software such as Optionsoracle (www.samosky.com) and play with the price and chart, or use TOS analysis, etc.

"At least, that's my $0.02 worth..."

Hey, it is more than that :)

-
--- In OptionClub@yahoogroups.com, "janzen257" <yahoo.to.mj257@...> wrote:
>
> > Does anybody know how to do these adjustments, if so please show
> simulations in TOS.
> >
> > 1. BUTTERFLY ROLL
> > 2. ASYMMETRICAL BUTTERFLY ROLL
> > 3. ASYMMETRICAL BUTTERFLY RATIO ROLL
> > [you get the idea]
>
> Isn't this exactly like one of those "Do my homework for me!" questions
> that you see on technical forums all the time? Right...
>
> In this context, though, I get the distinct sense that this list comes
> from the marketing material for some sort of seminar or course, and that
> the writer is curious but doesn't want to spend thousands to learn the
> magic.
>
> If so, he's probably on the right track. A mess of jargon like this
> sounds to me like someone's trying to dress up some standard options
> theory and charge a bundle for teaching you the exclusive, hidden
> secrets previously known only to insiders.
>
> Sure, people in this business love to give flashy names to their trades:
> straddles, strangles, butterflies, iron condors -- I've even heard of
> "centipedes" and "pterodactyls", for crying out loud. And a certain
> amount of terminology is useful: it's easier and clearer to say, "I sold
> an iron condor" than "I sold a call spread and a put spread with the
> same underlying and the same expiration". But someone's really getting
> carried away here. Who on earth would say, "Oh, the price of XYZ has
> moved up; now I need to do an asymmetrical butterfly ratio roll"?
>
> My suggestion: Save your money. Instead, spend it on some good books
> (eg. Natenberg), watch the free videos at the CBOE (especially Dan
> Sheridan's), check out the educational materials that your broker
> provides, read forums such as this one -- in short, learn the basics.
> If you understand vertical spreads, you won't need to memorize the
> details of how and when to do an "asymmetrical butterfly ratio roll"
> versus a "symmetrical iron condor non-ratio roll", or what have you.
> You'll just look at what you have now, decide whether you still want it,
> figure out what you'd rather have instead, and then make the appropriate
> changes. No fancy names required.
>
> At least, that's my $0.02 worth...
>
> Martin
>

__._,_.___
The goal of TheOptionClub is to provide a forum for members to work together for the purpose of furthering our individual understanding option trading.  All messages and postings, and any materials circulated are provided for discussion and educational purposes only.  No statement contained in any materials from TheOptionClub should be considered a recommendation to buy or sell a security or to provide investment, legal or tax advice.  All investors are encouraged to consult a qualified professional before trading in any security.  Stock and option trading involves risk and is not suitable for most people.  There is no guarantee that any information provided is accurate and, may in fact, be wrong.  It is understood that the participants in TheOptionClub have varying backgrounds and degrees of experience in option trading, and that regardless of experience each member is considered a student.  As such, any information distributed through TheOptionClub should be considered with a critical mind and not relied upon as an authoritative source.

To unsubscribe from TheOptionClub, send an email to:
OptionClub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Recent Activity
Visit Your Group
Yahoo! Finance

It's Now Personal

Guides, news,

advice & more.

New web site?

Drive traffic now.

Get your business

on Yahoo! search.

Health Groups

for people over 40

Join people who are

staying in shape.

.

__,_._,___
Posted by at No comments:

Re: [TheOptionClub.com] IC Delta as an Exit/Adjustment Indicator



"I want to get out from the trade with at 10%-20% profit ,so I need to sell long call 10.80*1.1=11.88$"

what strike/month? how do you get 11.88?

--- In OptionClub@yahoogroups.com, "Nava Elgar" <nava@...> wrote:
>
> I will try to explain myself with example:
>
> Let say I have IC on FLS :bull put 60/55+bear call 80/85 credit 0.80$ risk
> 4.20$ for June.
>
> and now one of the short broke assume the side of short call 80$.
> what do I do?
> 1 . The IC stay as it is.
> 2.add long call for Oct (I can't see shorter time in the chain) at $ 80 ask
> price :6.6$
>
> what is your new risk: (6.60+4.2)=10.80 debit.
> I want to get out from the trade with at 10%-20% profit ,so I need to sell
> long call
> 10.80*1.1=11.88$
> is it make sence?
>
> we can go on and built the progrem :with exit point PE,SE.
> (btw I call it IC plus )
>
> Nava Elgar
>
>
> www.GoBulls.co.il
>
> ----------------------------------------
>
> From: "Akram Khan" <bronchoscope@...>
> Sent: Saturday, May 30, 2009 4:58 AM
> To: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [TheOptionClub.com] IC Delta as an Exit/Adjustment Indicator
>
> Nava when the IC hits your short strike you are saying you buy a long
> option ATM two months out turning that strike into a calendar and having an
> extra long strike (from your original IC)?
>
> Akram Khan
>
>
> From: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com [mailto:OptionClub@yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of Nava Elgar
> Sent: Friday, May 29, 2009 2:05 PM
> To: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: re: [TheOptionClub.com] IC Delta as an Exit/Adjustment Indicator
>
>
> I adjust Iron Condor in this way:
> when the stock hits the short strike I am hadding long ATM for another 2
> month.
>
> When it happen my Iron condor now he's Iron condor plus.
>
> I am looking from my long to cover my original risk +the risk of the long
> +% gain.
>
> Did it in the past and it is working.
>
> Keep simple.
>
> Nava Elgar
>
>
> www.GoBulls.co.il
>
> ----------------------------------------
>
> From: "cguy444" <carmelo5791@...>
> Sent: Friday, May 29, 2009 6:09 AM
> To: OptionClub@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [TheOptionClub.com] IC Delta as an Exit/Adjustment Indicator
>
> Does anyone here use delta as one way of determining when to exit or adjust
> an Iron Condor position?
>
> I recently watched a CBOE webinar by Dan Sheridan where the topic was
> adjusting condors. He said when the delta reaches a certain point think
> "Danger Will Robinson" :-). He didn't get into too many specifics so I
> thought I'd ask the group.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Carmelo
>

__._,_.___
The goal of TheOptionClub is to provide a forum for members to work together for the purpose of furthering our individual understanding option trading.  All messages and postings, and any materials circulated are provided for discussion and educational purposes only.  No statement contained in any materials from TheOptionClub should be considered a recommendation to buy or sell a security or to provide investment, legal or tax advice.  All investors are encouraged to consult a qualified professional before trading in any security.  Stock and option trading involves risk and is not suitable for most people.  There is no guarantee that any information provided is accurate and, may in fact, be wrong.  It is understood that the participants in TheOptionClub have varying backgrounds and degrees of experience in option trading, and that regardless of experience each member is considered a student.  As such, any information distributed through TheOptionClub should be considered with a critical mind and not relied upon as an authoritative source.

To unsubscribe from TheOptionClub, send an email to:
OptionClub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Recent Activity
Visit Your Group
Give Back

Yahoo! for Good

Get inspired

by a good cause.

Y! Toolbar

Get it Free!

easy 1-click access

to your groups.

Yahoo! Groups

Start a group

in 3 easy steps.

Connect with others.

.

__,_._,___
Posted by at No comments:

[ConservativeOptionStrategies] In the money



Hi All,

I have read that writing in the money puts and calls are safer than writing out of the money puts and call. I was wondering what folks thoughts are about the subject.

Thanks in advance,

Randy

__._,_.___
Recent Activity
Visit Your Group
Give Back

Yahoo! for Good

Get inspired

by a good cause.

Y! Toolbar

Get it Free!

easy 1-click access

to your groups.

Yahoo! Groups

Start a group

in 3 easy steps.

Connect with others.

.

__,_._,___
Posted by at No comments:
Subscribe to: Posts (Atom)